Brushless motor considerations for the II

[1967Typhoon]

I totally agree. The market is way too niche to have more vendors step in.

I would also like to clarify that I was in no way, shape, or form saying that HH motors aren't worth it. They are. It would just be nice if there were some cheaper brushless options, even if the quality won't match that of an HH motor. I understand the costs incurred with high-level RC. I have raced for a number of years. I am just hoping for someone to come along and make products similar in performance but easier on the wallet, similar to what Hobbywing did 5-7 years ago.

This discussion has gotten a bit off topic now, have a great day guys!

 

[Waitwhatsthat?]

Just to throw my hat in the ring. I recently installed a cheap brushless setup that I had in my parts bin. Its a trackstar 4250 kv sensored motor and a hobby king 120 a esc. I know it's overkill but it was free and I was curious about brushless. My initial thoughts are good. It has as good low end control as my silver can 35 t motor had, but with tons more wheelspeed. I wrapped tape around the motor to seal up the vent holes, and waterproofed the esc and motor with conformal coating. I'll report back once I get some more run time with it and a better feel for how it does. If I like it, I'll end up getting a smaller esc thats actually made for a crawler.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[Nealiuo240z]

I am defiantly curious to see how this plays out. I am in the same boat- torn between the Puller Pro BL 540 Stubby in the 2200kv, 2700kv, or the 3300kv. Any word on the two speed transmission assemblies yet? That could influence motor decision in a big way.

 

[imthatguy]

I am defiantly curious to see how this plays out. I am in the same boat- torn between the Puller Pro BL 540 Stubby in the 2200kv, 2700kv, or the 3300kv. Any word on the two speed transmission assemblies yet? That could influence motor decision in a big way.

If you're running a Brushless, sensored motor on 3S, I can't see any reason to want a 2 speed transmission in a trail/crawling truck. But that's just me.

 

[Nealiuo240z]

Just to have it. High speed to connect trails, and very very low for rock play.

 

[arnesto]

MMP and Roc 412 3100kv plus 3S = awesome power and great low speed control, could be a touch less with stock gearing, but programming the esc and radio will temper the excess "thumbsup"

 

[pete959]

I run a 2 speed in my tf2 with a 2200kv roc and mmp i have it set so low is for technical crawls and high is for hey yall watch this

LIFE IS GOOD

 

[Waitwhatsthat?]

Well my first test run with the 4250 kv race system was good and bad. The low end control was great, and the top end speed was fantastic. I will admit that it's going to take awhile to get used to the kind of power this thing puts out. The bad parts was with descents. I couldn't really get it to make a slow controllable descent. The brake keep locking it up. I'm gonna play with the drag brake settings to see if I can get to work ok. It is a racing esc though, so I'm not sure if it's gonna work out. If all else fails I'll keep the motor and ditch the esc for a smaller, more crawler oriented one.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[ElChupacabra]

Just to have it. High speed to connect trails, and very very low for rock play.

I refuse to move at the speed my truck would be going with a high kv motor in high gear. I can connect trails just fine at a nice leisurely walk with my single speed and a 2200kv stubby.

 

[Waitwhatsthat?]

Ok so after getting some more time in, I started having issues. I started hearing a grinding type of noise, and power was extremely decreased, and would sometimes completely go dead. I'm pretty sure it was overheating, quite possibly the esc. I had removed the fan, thinking I wouldn't need it. I didn't have a temp gun on the trail with me, so I'm not sure how hot everything got. The esc did flash a code. Im gonna try and find a manual for the thing to see what it means.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[Nealiuo240z]

I refuse to move at the speed my truck would be going with a high kv motor in high gear. I can connect trails just fine at a nice leisurely walk with my single speed and a 2200kv stubby.

How do you like the 2200kv stubby in the SCX10-II? How is the crawl-ability and speed? Now im torn between the 2200kv and the 2700kv... Feedback?

 

[ElChupacabra]

How do you like the 2200kv stubby in the SCX10-II? How is the crawl-ability and speed? Now im torn between the 2200kv and the 2700kv... Feedback?

I've only run the 2200 in the SCX10 and not the II. I like the 2200. I feel like I'm less likely to break anything yet have plenty of wheel speed. I have it geared to 56/11 with 32p gears. I also don't like a really fast rig. I can see some people thinking the 2200 is too slow. I'm running 3s as well.

 

[Haziza]

I have Pro Puller 2200kv in mine with stock gearing! Got some speed and crawls fine with some small changes in the MMP esc!


Sent from my iPhone

 

[Benbot]

This wait for Holmes Hobbies to get the 3500KV Puller Pro in stock is killing me, but I really want a waterproof setup.

 

[Motorider]

I have the HH 2200kv waterproof puller pro in my scx10.2 and I really like it. I do wish I had purchased the 2700kv. It was out of stock for a long time and I really needed a motor to get this rig up and going. If I have to I will gear up a little to get some more wheel speed. 3s is a must with the 2200kv. I truely feel that the 2700kv would be the best of all worlds with regards to the HH puller pro motors.

I am looking to try one of these ten shock motors for my 7 yr old daughters truck. It will be an scx10.2 that she is building herself. She does not have the trigger control yet to justify a $130 motor from holmes.

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

Wow, you are making a LOT of assumptions there.

I understand the complexity and what it takes to make such a motor. The fact is though, ALL sensored motors have tremendously good low end control.

I think you overestimate how similar HH brushless motors are to regular sensored racing motors. You put in a much larger rotor for more torque, you pick a can with little to no venting, and you waterproof the sensor board using a conformal coating or an epoxy. That's it. That is the only difference. You make it sound like what HH is doing is rocket science. It's not. His motors are slight variations on what is already out there. If he can do it, other manufacturers can too. His pricing is high due to having to produce smaller runs, and also because he has cornered the market. It's no more complex than that.

Wow, it's so simple! Why doesn't everyone just run cheap racing motors!?!? Just throw in a big rotor, that always works better!:lmao::lmao:

Ever engineered an electromechanical device? Know what FEMM is? Understand concepts of detent force? Know what happens to steel losses and no load current when a larger rotor is used?


Want to know why the Novaks crawler motor sucked? It was a race motor with a larger rotor slapped in. Just like every other "crawler" brushless motor made besides mine and Tekin. You are right that it is easy to slap a motor together that has the right "bench specs" for crawling. Now, try making one that starts smoothly, has good torque density, and also runs efficiently. That pesky real world usage...



You underestimate how much engineering I put into motors. But don't take my word for it, ask folks why they are willing to buy them vs the cheap stuff.



I'm running a 3500kv standard Puller Pro 540 on 3s. I prefer the 2700 kv for general trail use though.

 

[allanon1965]

Well my first test run with the 4250 kv race system was good and bad. The low end control was great, and the top end speed was fantastic. I will admit that it's going to take awhile to get used to the kind of power this thing puts out. The bad parts was with descents. I couldn't really get it to make a slow controllable descent. The brake keep locking it up. I'm gonna play with the drag brake settings to see if I can get to work ok. It is a racing esc though, so I'm not sure if it's gonna work out. If all else fails I'll keep the motor and ditch the esc for a smaller, more crawler oriented one.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

This is what i would expect out of a brushless racing combination in a crawler...the motor is a touch too fast with less torque than a smaller kv motor and the esc is just plain wrong for a crawler as you are discovering now.

It could be that an esc such as the MMP or holmes brushless crawler esc can find a happy middle with the motor. I am not sure of how that motor will allow the drag brake function to work well in a crawler, time will tell..

thanks for the update so far and keep us posted"thumbsup"

 

[allanon1965]

You underestimate how much engineering I put into motors. But don't take my word for it, ask folks why they are willing to buy them vs the cheap stuff.






Mainly because most of understand you get what you pay for, and while putting a corvette motor in a go cart seems cool at the time, it just doesnt work out in the long run"thumbsup"

I run crawler motors in crawlers and race motors in my go fast stuff"thumbsup"

 

[Motorider]

Wow, it's so simple! Why doesn't everyone just run cheap racing motors!?!? Just throw in a big rotor, that always works better!:lmao::lmao:

Ever engineered an electromechanical device? Know what FEMM is? Understand concepts of detent force? Know what happens to steel losses and no load current when a larger rotor is used?


Want to know why the Novaks crawler motor sucked? It was a race motor with a larger rotor slapped in. Just like every other "crawler" brushless motor made besides mine and Tekin. You are right that it is easy to slap a motor together that has the right "bench specs" for crawling. Now, try making one that starts smoothly, has good torque density, and also runs efficiently. That pesky real world usage...



You underestimate how much engineering I put into motors. But don't take my word for it, ask folks why they are willing to buy them vs the cheap stuff.



I'm running a 3500kv standard Puller Pro 540 on 3s. I prefer the 2700 kv for general trail use though.

John, Im running one of your 2200kv standard puller pros and love it. I wish I had gotten the 2700, but it was out of stock and it may take a few weeks to get it back in. I was out of time to wait and pulled the trigger on the 2200. It is awesome and I have no regrets, but my 7 year old who is just getting started into the hobby does not need a $132 motor. I simply can not afford it right now. I brought this up because i figured she could survive with a 40 dollar tenshock motor for now. I have a used mmp esc i got real cheap.

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

I'm with you on cheap stuff for kids!