Ford's future plans in North America

[Mike Flea]

Against my better judgement, I'm going to enter this conversation.

I currently have a 2014 Jeep Patriot, and the wife has a '99 Chrysler minivan. They both have 4 cyl's, the van gets decent mileage, 17/ 24, the Patriot, 21/28, and I'm an aggressive driver ( not an asshole aggressive, I don't cut other vehicles off, but if I can safely pass a line of slow drivers on a 2 lane country road, I will), the Pat has excellent get-up-&-go.

I've had some import cars in my lifetime, (going on 60, been driving since I was 14, licensed at 16). I had a '72 Fiat 128, (4cyl/4sp), traded for a '72 Datsun pick up, (4 cyl/4sp), traded for a '72 Mercury Capri ( made in Germany), great car with the V-6, and 4spd, Fiat and Capri both nimble & fast, bought used while stationed in Hawaii. Another guy was rotating out and sold me his '64 Austin Healy Sprite for $100, (4cyl/4sp), loved that car. It was like driving a street legal go-kart.

Had a lot of American cars, trucks , and bikes. One of the most fun cars I owned, besides the Austin, was an '88 Yugo that I bought new, ($3900, from a dealer that also sold new Caddilac's) and if the war in Yugoslavia wouldn't have split up the country, I think I'd still have it, but I was afraid I wouldn't be able to get parts when and if I needed to repair it.

 

[CM9000]

Kia offers a lot of bang for the buck and makes some nice looking cars. I love the look and specs of the Stinger, but it gets a little pricey when you load up the GT.

the K900 is where its at! "thumbsup"

 

[skellyo]

the K900 is where its at! "thumbsup"

Nice looking car. Although, I think I just fell in love watching a video of the new Audi RS5 Sportback.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/uvRhXQ0ZLkc" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[BigSki]

...Subaru Crosstrek, Forester or Outback! AWD is where it's at, my Forester gets great mileage and is pretty quick for a wagon that off-roads nicely...

The year that I owned a "beater" '99 Forester wagon completely changed my opinion about them, and AWD in general. I quickly realized that their AWD system simply works very well and it just wasn't for snow covered roads. It adds such a high safety factor into driving when it's raining or on a old black top road that's covered in wet leaves. Once the Forester died, I got a '07 CRV AWD thinking that the extra room would be nice and it would be like still having a Subbie- boy was I wrong. That CRV, while it was easier for me to get in and out of, and it had a slightly better view of the road, it wasn't even in the same class in regards to handling and ability to swallow up cargo o how well the AWD system functioned.

The old Subbie even got better fuel mileage even though it was using older transmission technology ( 4 speed vs. 5 speed auto ) and the AWD system was always sending a bit of power rearward, and could deliver up to a 50/50 split ( along with the mechanical LSD diffy ) where the Honda would only do up to 30% power sent rearward and it used that stupidly expensive special fluid in the diffy that needed changing ever 30K miles.

I also recently test drove a 2017 Kia Forte with the manual trans. I have to say that it was a really great driving small car that didn't feel small on the inside. The seats supported my big butt and I had ample clearance between my shoulders and the B pillar as well as good head room. $18K for a brand new car wasn't too bad, I just couldn't take on any debt or I would have given it some very serious consideration. I also drove a base 2017 Forester w/ the 6 speed manual and really liked the car, but at $22K for a stripped base model car I didn't see enough value, even if I could have afforded it.

 

[hpiguy]

That Audi sportback is an abominaton. I've asked for years that they bring the RS3 sportback, which is a wagon to the US, and this is what we get in the US? F you Audi. This is what a sportback is supposed to look like.

 

[JDM74]

I'm also curious to see what Ford is going to do with their police interceptor sedans. They are based on the Taurus. I bet they don't go away.

 

[OSRC]

Was always a car guy...Started with Ford Escorts and EXP's, then was into Civics/CRX's for a bit, then Mustangs, Probes, and Miatas. All stick mind you.

Then kids happened, and I needed something bigger. Picked up my 06 Xterra and fell in love. More room, 6 speed, pulls like a mule and goes anywhere in the winter. I've had this truck for longer than I've had any other vehicle, and still like it as much as the day I test drove it. It is getting a bit rough around the edges but it's got a few more years left.

Have a Mazda6 6 speed as my "daily driver." Went with the Mazda because it's fun to drive, fits the kids out back, and it's stick. There is nothing domestic with a stick trans anymore....maybe a Focus and a few other small cars, but I wanted something bigger. That's huge factor when I buy a car, and it's sadly limiting choices. Subaru was on the list, but after driving the 6 and the Crosstrek, I liked the 6 much better. (Plus I have the X for winter weather)

Also have a Miata in the garage for fun, and the wife has a Mazda3 5 speed. We really like Mazda's....Very sporty and have held up well for us.

Oh, and I inherited (kinda) my fathers 2003 F150 FXT with 28k and lots of rust. So that's in the driveway as well.

So we've got 5 cars out there, and currently my wife is the only one working... kinda comical. We've got to pair it down, but not sure what to get rid of yet other than the Miata.

For the future, Wife is looking at a Mazda5 stick or a Crosstrek, and I am considering a newer Frontier or Xterra stick. Guess Ford is onto something ...there's no sedans on the table at all. If there was a full size stick wagon, I'd be all over it (Magnum RT for example) but that's a fantasy as this point.

 

[JDM74]

I too usually drive stick vehicles but have succumbed to the lack of choices. I have a 99 Miata in the garage as well as a Yamaha FZ-07. I had a Wrangler unlimited Rubicon with a manual and that was the most poorly executed manual vehicle I have ever driven. Combine the delay from the pedal by wire throttle and the crappy clutch and it was not easy to drive. I ended up trading it in for reliability reasons on a 4runner Trail edition. No manual available for that guy and me and the auto are fighting almost every time I drive it. Other than that, I love it though, lol.

The Miata 5 speed is the best manual transmission I have ever driven (I hear the s2000's have great shifting trannies too) and it has 270K miles on it. It is one of the last throttle by cable vehicles at a 1999 model.

 

[CM9000]

throttle by cable and shifting by arm and leg is the only way ill drive a daily till I die.

a company, in Australia, came out with a t56 trick shifter... and will later make some for the t5 and other transmissions. allowing us to shift our manual vehicles like a dogbox.... but with the clutch for all gears though.

I don't think all of the cars will go away to be completely honest. they think they can predict the future.. but the generation under us millennial's.. is becoming more and more unpredictable.

there should always be at least 4 different base models to chose from. sport car, sedan, crossover, and a truck. that's just my opinion though. based on and educated observation of the community around me.

 

[tuanies]

That Audi sportback is an abominaton. I've asked for years that they bring the RS3 sportback, which is a wagon to the US, and this is what we get in the US? F you Audi. This is what a sportback is supposed to look like.

RS3 is a hatchback and not a wagon. A wagon would have the same length, if not more than it's sedan counterpart whereas a hatchback is shorter than the sedan. Sportbacks are liftbacks - sedans with the whole trunk + rear window lifts up. The A7 is a sportback.

I'm also curious to see what Ford is going to do with their police interceptor sedans. They are based on the Taurus. I bet they don't go away.

The Explorer is based on the same platform and shares like 90% of the same components? The Explorer was also outselling the Taurus police interceptors over 2 to 1 back in 2015, probably more so now. I doubt the police department will notice the Taurus missing.

For the future, Wife is looking at a Mazda5 stick or a Crosstrek, and I am considering a newer Frontier or Xterra stick. Guess Ford is onto something ...there's no sedans on the table at all. If there was a full size stick wagon, I'd be all over it (Magnum RT for example) but that's a fantasy as this point.

I had a 2014 Mazda5 6MT, was a ton of fun, especially lowered on coilovers, Mazdaspeed3 rear sway bar and sticky rubber on 18-inch MS3 wheels.

But your post highlights exactly why automakers discontinued the vehicles you want - you buy them used. Automakers don't make money on used cars, so why should they cater to those that aren't their direct customers?

 

[hpiguy]

Call whatever you want, that shape was known as a wagon when I was growing up. I guess these days people feel emasculated by the term wagon or something, I dunno. :roll: Either way, now that I've owned a compact wagon, and seen the utility of it, I'd be hard pressed to own anything else in a car unless it was just a weekend toy. And the RS3 sportback would be my pick in the Audi lineup.

 

[Shinchu]

i think ford is shooting themselves in the foot here. my mother in law and a friend of mine at work both have a fusion hybrid and they are great. the friend at work traded in his fusion ecoboost (he tuned it and had an intake on it, quick! for a sedan.)

i just don't understand why you would ax so much product, unless its BAD. and i wouldn't really call any ford product "bad" at this point.
i'm not a ford guy at all (my dad was, kinda), but i recognize achievement in sales when i see it.

Any comments on the state of our automotive industry?

Favorite types of daily-driver vehicles?

"Ideal" daily driver characteristics?

as for these questions...

i think the current automotive industry is WAY too choked up by government regulations that "keep us from dying". aka: people are dumb, make cars do it all themselves. which leads to my next answers...

my favorite types of daily drivers would be... well what i drive now.
2016 scion FRS.
hardly anything comes close. its affordable, gets over 20 mpg, handles like a dream, holds my whole family (for now, more on that in a sec), MANUAL TRANSMISSION, RWD.
(let me know if pic doesn't work, tinypic acting weird for me again)

for my next answer, see the last part of my previous answer, the all caps part.
i am sick of consumers getting neutered vehicles that could have been awesome with a third pedal. WHY?! why is this happening??? are we too stupid, or lazy to operate a manual transmission now? a few videos hit the interwebz of irresponsible mustang owners, and suddenly we have no options for interrupting drivetrain with our foot?

that said...
i mentioned earlier my scion fits my family of 4. well I'm about to be a family of FIVE. yep. little Tyler is due in October. and that means... NO MORE FRS. :shock:
what do?
i need manual gearbox. RWD. 4 doors. and as much rear legroom as i can find.

i have searched high and low. sideways and upside down.
BMW, Cadillac, lexus... all years even down to the is300 from 2004. not enough legroom.
wait...
whats this?
the infiniti G37 sedan has 34 inches of rear legroom? manual trans with limited slip?! GIMME!!!:twisted:
now i just need to wait until Feb when my lease expires on the scion.
most likely will go to CarMax and have them ship me one from wherever, and change it to CA registration.

so yeah, my preference for a daily is SPORTY.
if i need capacity and ground clearance, my wife has a grand Cherokee. "thumbsup"
and when that lease is up 5 months after my scion, she wants a Honda pilot. and if its not 4WD I'm using that for an excuse to get an awesome (read: vintage w/solid axles) work/camping rig.

have i driven a ford lately? nah. and i don't plan to anytime soon (unless i can get a 79 F250 supercab? suddenly a fan of 2wd pilot...)

 

[tuanies]

Call whatever you want, that shape was known as a wagon when I was growing up. I guess these days people feel emasculated by the term wagon or something, I dunno. :roll: Either way, now that I've owned a compact wagon, and seen the utility of it, I'd be hard pressed to own anything else in a car unless it was just a weekend toy. And the RS3 sportback would be my pick in the Audi lineup.

There is a difference between wagon and hatchback due to size. Wagons are usually longer and more have more room.

Wagon

Hatchback

 

[JatoTheRipper]

We still absolutely suck at making small and mid size cars and small trucks.

I don't think any American car company makes small trucks at this point. The S-10 and Ranger are long dead. The Colorado isn't small IMO.

As far as American companies not being able to make good small and mid-size cars I would disagree and I'm guessing you don't have much experience with many of the new models from the Big 2. Dodge isn't good at making anything, except power, so I wouldn't include them.


As for you stick lovers, here is a list of the new cars available with a manual transmission:

The Dwindling List of Manual Cars You Can Buy New - The Drive

 

[tuanies]

I don't think any American car company makes small trucks at this point. The S-10 and Ranger are long dead. The Colorado isn't small IMO.

As far as American companies not being able to make good small and mid-size cars I would disagree and I'm guessing you don't have much experience with many of the new models from the Big 2. Dodge isn't good at making anything, except power, so I wouldn't include them.


As for you stick lovers, here is a list of the new cars available with a manual transmission:

The Dwindling List of Manual Cars You Can Buy New - The Drive

Ford makes great small cars. The Fiesta ST is a hoot, as is the turbo 3-cylinder base Fiesta. The Focus is enjoyable as well - the problem is all the cars in that class are good or good enough for most people. The Focus and Fiesta are infinitely better than the Yaris and Corolla, but the Kia, Hyundais, Hondas and VWs are stellar as well.

Its a tough market with extremely tight margins.

Also the new small trucks are about 3/4 the size of the full-size, which make them about the same size as a 90s full size. The Frontier is probably the smallest truck now and its been unchanged for about a decade.

 

[calcagno45]

a company, in Australia, came out with a t56 trick shifter... and will later make some for the t5 and other transmissions. allowing us to shift our manual vehicles like a dogbox.... but with the clutch for all gears though.

https://www.bremershifters.com/

These things are nuts! and a little pricey.

I don't think any American car company makes small trucks at this point. The S-10 and Ranger are long dead. The Colorado isn't small IMO.

The Ranger is coming back yo!

 

[JatoTheRipper]

Ford makes great small cars. The Fiesta ST is a hoot, as is the turbo 3-cylinder base Fiesta. The Focus is enjoyable as well - the problem is all the cars in that class are good or good enough for most people. The Focus and Fiesta are infinitely better than the Yaris and Corolla, but the Kia, Hyundais, Hondas and VWs are stellar as well.

Its a tough market with extremely tight margins.

Also the new small trucks are about 3/4 the size of the full-size, which make them about the same size as a 90s full size. The Frontier is probably the smallest truck now and its been unchanged for about a decade.

Yep, lots of companies make good, little cars with the US included in that.

I agree. The new small trucks are more 3/4 size than small which, to me, doesn't make much sense.

Speaking of Frontier, Nissan makes the fugliest full-size truck, don't they? The first time I saw a Titan in person I was shocked. It has the rare ability to look worse in person than it does in photos. It looks like something Mahindra or Tata would make. Their older stuff, like the Frontier, was nice looking if not utilitarian, but somewhere along the line Nissan lost their way.

The Ranger is coming back yo!

Yes, but the new Ranger will probably be about the size of a Colorado which isn't a small truck IMO. It's more mid-size.

Personally, I don't see the point of 3/4 trucks. I mean the size and the pricing of them would make me go full size. But that might be the mini fan in me talking. I wish we'd still have OG Ranger/S-10 sized trucks.

 

[Shinchu]

lol Jato I'm not sure to be offended or not that i fall into the category of "stick lover" lol

but all the cars on that list... only a handful are RWD. even less of those have 4 doors.
all the ones i already mentioned. but i missed one.
the Genesis G70?! dafug is that?!
oh, ok not bad at $32k. but only 250hp on a turbo 4? ehhhh...
i will "stick" with the infiniti G37 sedan. (is Genesis the reason infiniti renamed their G line to Q? seniority means nothing nowadays...?)

yes, the ranger is supposedly coming back, with the bronco. supposedly.
and i took it as the Colorado replaced the S-10.

*jato yes 3/4 size is odd. when my mom was looking for a truck back in 99ish, i showed her the Dakota. it was too big. or... too small. it was both somehow. she ended up with a 1st gen Tacoma.

 

[tuanies]

Personally, I don't see the point of 3/4 trucks. I mean the size and the pricing of them would make me go full size. But that might be the mini fan in me talking. I wish we'd still have OG Ranger/S-10 sized trucks.

That's why I went with buying an imported kei pickup truck. Was looking at '04+ Dodge Dakotas, but the prices for decent ones were about $10k+, almost as much as a Ram 1500 and at the end of the day, it still takes up about the same amount of space in as the full-size in my driveway. Ended up with a '93 Suzuki Carry which does everything I need it to, with a bed that's more usable than a QuadCab short bed.

 

[JatoTheRipper]

lol Jato I'm not sure to be offended or not that i fall into the category of "stick lover" lol

:lmao: