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HobbiCo / Great Planes / Tower Hobbies
- Thread starter JatoTheRipper
- Start date
wings_of_fire
Quarry Creeper
2 million by Futaba :shock:
This credit system in business is the worst thing ever. But if all businesses start running on immediate payment mode, then there won't be enough money in the market to back it.
I personally take immediate payments and pay my vendors immediately after parts pass quality check. The companies that ask for credit.. .I politely ask them to take a hike :lmao:
allanon1965
I wanna be Dave
I saw that, but was curious how many it actually was, 200-999 is quite the spread"thumbsup"
OMFG ..... where all the money go!? :shock:
Guessing an employee owned company didnt have an employee owned accountant.
Nice find!
That's a lot of smoke that they owe.
So when their Tamiya products say "On order" I think that means maybe never since they owe them over $600k!
****, one mistake does not get you this far into debt. Well, unless it's a mistake like overpaying for Axial/Durango and whatever other brand was part of that deal.
It's still not worth it unless you were thinking of getting a Redcat for $200 for some silly reason. It's the old truck.
skinnyj
Pebble Pounder
I'm guessing one of those in the top 5 was their original plastics maker for Axial.
The other one that is surprising is UPS. Typically, they are the last ones you screw, as they don't hesitate to shut off service for non-payment.
The other one that is surprising is UPS. Typically, they are the last ones you screw, as they don't hesitate to shut off service for non-payment.
OSRC
I wanna be Dave
Without knowing yearly numbers, the amounts owed are hard to put into context. Futaba being number one is quite surprising though. Bad news seeing some of those names on the amounts owed list. If there's no repayment of those funds, there could be a significant ripple effect throughout the hobby.
I keep reading everywhere that Traxxas would snap up Axial. Not sure if that's a real sentiment or just the fanboys tweaking fanboys, but that would never happen. Why would they? Doesn't at all fit in their business model. Besides, note that there's a large amount of lawyer fees on that list - no doubt from the Traxxas lawsuit. Pisses me off.
I think it's going to be hard for GP to come back from this just given the raw numbers. Best case scenario I would guess quite a few of those in-house brands are going to be sold off, and GP will reorganize smaller as a distributor only which is their core business.
That's my guess anyway...
I keep reading everywhere that Traxxas would snap up Axial. Not sure if that's a real sentiment or just the fanboys tweaking fanboys, but that would never happen. Why would they? Doesn't at all fit in their business model. Besides, note that there's a large amount of lawyer fees on that list - no doubt from the Traxxas lawsuit. Pisses me off.
I think it's going to be hard for GP to come back from this just given the raw numbers. Best case scenario I would guess quite a few of those in-house brands are going to be sold off, and GP will reorganize smaller as a distributor only which is their core business.
That's my guess anyway...
mikemcE
I wanna be Dave
One thing not mentioned is how much merchandise is in towers warehouses vs debt owed. Every nickel is counted and mentioned.
Hang up and Drive
Hang up and Drive
I don't think that Traxxas will scoop up Axial either, but not necessarily because it doesn't fit their business model. Any good business knows that diversification is a good thing, so picking something that's still in their technical field, would utilize the same manufacturing & distribution channels, but would appeal to a different group of buyers seems like a fantastic idea to me.Without knowing yearly numbers, the amounts owed are hard to put into context. Futaba being number one is quite surprising though. Bad news seeing some of those names on the amounts owed list. If there's no repayment of those funds, there could be a significant ripple effect throughout the hobby.
I keep reading everywhere that Traxxas would snap up Axial. Not sure if that's a real sentiment or just the fanboys tweaking fanboys, but that would never happen. Why would they? Doesn't at all fit in their business model. Besides, note that there's a large amount of lawyer fees on that list - no doubt from the Traxxas lawsuit. Pisses me off.
I think it's going to be hard for GP to come back from this just given the raw numbers. Best case scenario I would guess quite a few of those in-house brands are going to be sold off, and GP will reorganize smaller as a distributor only which is their core business.
That's my guess anyway...
But, I don't recall Traxxas having bought up any other companies before, so I don't really see them doing it now. They've had enough success with the TRX4 that if they want a bigger piece of the crawler market, they can do it without sucking up Axial.
skinnyj
Pebble Pounder
Sometimes it is better to take a wait and see approach. I've seen companies buy failing/struggling competition in an effort to get the inside track on customer lists/formulations/tech ect. only to have the purchased company bring the purchaser down.
I keep seeing that Traxxas will buy up Axial as well, I am fairly sure that is just speculation with no real salt in it. Historically, Traxxas has never been a company to buy other companies, they pretty much just stick to their own brand. The real question is, why would they? Seems like Traxxas is doing fine on its own.
Futaba really isn't that big of a surprise to me, I know very few people that run Futaba gear. At comps and get-togethers I see a lot of Spektrum, a lot of stock radios of various brands, and a smattering of Flyskys, but no Futaba. Futaba has always made a tough and reliable radio, but their interface has always been difficult to navigate and set up.
Hobbico will have to fish or cut bait to survive. I can see them holding on to the brands that are the most profitable, most likely consolidating the names, selling off brands that they can, and liquidating the rest.
K-Mart/Sears ring a bell?
If a company like Traxxas buys Axial (I'm confident they won't) they would take the good stuff and then just shut the company down because they are competition. Axial's asking price, if they get sold, will probably be too high to make that worthwhile.
I don't see any company short of an investment firm or a cheap brand like Redcat being interested in buying Axial. The companies that want crawlers in their stable already have one.
I don't see any company short of an investment firm or a cheap brand like Redcat being interested in buying Axial. The companies that want crawlers in their stable already have one.
makya
Quarry Creeper
Without knowing yearly numbers, the amounts owed are hard to put into context. Futaba being number one is quite surprising though. Bad news seeing some of those names on the amounts owed list. If there's no repayment of those funds, there could be a significant ripple effect throughout the hobby.
I keep reading everywhere that Traxxas would snap up Axial. Not sure if that's a real sentiment or just the fanboys tweaking fanboys, but that would never happen. Why would they? Doesn't at all fit in their business model. Besides, note that there's a large amount of lawyer fees on that list - no doubt from the Traxxas lawsuit. Pisses me off.
I think it's going to be hard for GP to come back from this just given the raw numbers. Best case scenario I would guess quite a few of those in-house brands are going to be sold off, and GP will reorganize smaller as a distributor only which is their core business.
That's my guess anyway...
I agree. Traxxas is a marketing company that makes R/C's. If they wanted to expand their crawler market, I could see them outsourcing under the LaTrax name before buying another company.
Axials only worth the name, other then that every ones copying them already. Sounds shiotty to say of them and its nothing against them but look at the market already. They built it up and everyone else came in with replicas.
I don't necessarily agree. Axial has brand recognition and a product lineup that's already well established. Axial, as far as we all know, is also a profitable company. It doesn't make sense to buy it only to dissolve it. It makes more sense to buy it because Traxxas already has a well established supply chain, as well as an equally well established distribution network. They presumably already have all of the same day to day departments that Axial has, like HR, Engineering, payroll, etc. Taking on another company that can benefit from the supply & distribution chains, and eliminating all of the duplication of HR, shipping/receiving, payroll, etc, can make 2 profitable companies run more efficiency, which raises profits higher. It makes a lot of sense for Traxxas to buy a company like Axial, and keep both product lines. I suspect that this is what Hobbico had planned with a lot of their acquisitions, but unfortunately, their acquisitions were of brands that were already in trouble.
That said, I'm not sure where the Traxxas acquisition rumors came from, but I don't see it happening. I don't recall Traxxas ever buying up any other companies.
Seems like this exact line comes up whenever a company gets in trouble, someone always says Traxxas is going to buy them. In fact, it looks like it is actually Hobbico that has been buying up all of the companies that have been in trouble... hmmmm.... Perhaps we are getting to the root of the problem? :roll:
I tend to agree. Axial had the market all to themselves and they let it slip away. The SCX10 II was delayed way too long and then when it came out people went "Meh" instead of "OMG I need one!"
Traxxas wouldn't want Axial's extensive line of products. Most of their products don't fall into their target audience. That's why it doesn't even make sense for Traxxas to buy Axial, but if they ever would they wouldn't keep most of the products IMO.
Axial, we assume, is profitable, but I'm sure it pales in comparison to Traxxas. Companies eat up other less valuable companies all the time sometimes for no reason other than to kill the competition. Again, I don't think Traxxas would do that because they aren't worried about Axial one bit.
calcagno45
RCC Addict
$2mil to Futaba means Hobbico was promising to pay for quite some time if i had to guess. Promises ultimately got broken...
The credit system is valid and is necessary to operate large corporations as there's many levels of BS to get cash moving in and out. I can approve invoices today but the check won't won't cut until 2 weeks after. And creditors talk to each other so word spreads when businesses aren't paying timely or according to terms set forth.
As many boxes that go out, I could see that number happening in a 2-3 month time span especially considering we just had Black Friday and Christmas shopping.
That's why I don't think Traxxas would ever buy them. They already have a successful trail truck and many successful go-fast bashing trucks, there's not much for Traxxas to purchase from Axial. The only item I could see is the rights to manufacture parts for post-sale support but even that goes 90% to aftermarket. to me, there's nothing in it for Traxxas.
One big sting to Hobbico was that Traxxas lawsuit. $1.2Mil on the books to a law firm, likely to defend against Traxxas.
Large companies keep lawyers on staff or on contract. That bill may or may not be from the lawsuit alone. But if HobbiCo/Arrma lawyers had done their works then they would never have violated the Traxxas patent. Blame HobbiCo/Arrma for this one not Traxxas. Traxxas is not the bad guy for defending their intellectual property.