OutRunner brushless motors?

[RATBASTARD808]

I picked up a UBEC for my brushless setup.

Wow this thing is great, The model I had picked up from 1 of the local flyer's is the KOOL BEC 35 Volt Ultimate BEC I think the (Ultimate BEC 6V Car / Marine 40 Volts Input / 6 Volts Output conformal coated to resist water) will be better for the Mamba.

The crawler responds quickly to inputs and steers very well with no strain or glitches to the power system. I am using hs-645mg front and the Spectrum/JR Z590m for the rear. I need to re-program the mamba so I could get a little more control to throttle response. The UBEC is a must for brushless systems using 3 cell lipo.

More testing this week to see how much amps the system is pulling from my battery packs. I will update with some numbers after next weekends HRCC comps.

RB808

 

[WRXronald]

update to gearing/motor selection...

well JRB does it again! have to say many thanks for user JohnRobHolmes of HolmesHobbies----

he hooked me up with one of his new brushless outrunners (my former outrunner was decent but was 5mm diameter shaft and the pinion size availability was not small enough).


in the meantime in had gone to a smaller outrunner from AXI, which was ok, but not great because slow crawling had a tendency to stall out... it would go over stuff well, but you really have to gun it and get it movin' and speed is not key when crawling.


Well JRB's came yesterady and i slapped it in there.... 10t pinion on 3.17mm shaft.... and all i can say is WOW!! PLENTY of power to get over obstacles and i can CREEPY CRAWL over them SUPER SLOW w/out worry of motor stall. i'm SO impressed with how slow i can go with this motor w/out ANY indication of stall or effort on the motor's part. i am running it 3s lipo, 11.1volt so i imagine that helps, but honestly i think it would work great on 2s lipo 8.4volt as well. i have programmed my heli tx throttle curve to apply a max of 80% throttle--- so i'm not even coming close to using the full power. 30 minutes of fiddlin' around and there is ZERO sign of effort from the motor or the battery. i'm guessing i'll easily get a solid hour+ runtime on a 2100lipo.


i was about to pick up a GD-600 and try to gear down because of the stall issue with the AXI, but after putting in the larger outrunner from JRB, it just won't be necessary. i can go SUPER SLOW with no stalling--- as well i could go quite a bit faster if ever needed. Its top speed is considerably faster than my Rockbull with Lathes and 9t's (ie will run circles around it).

Love this setup. i'm stickin' with it for good!

thanks JRB! keep up the good work!

 

[K_B]

Ron, what kind of outrunner is it? Sounds like I'm gonna be using my GD-600 (once I get the shaft turned down) :?

I just got my new Mamba-25 into my Park 370 powerd VMG. The thing has unbelievable torque. Too much wheelspeed, but once I get the low-end throttle response / cogging dialed in/out, I think that extra speed will come in handy.

It definitely takes some getting used to. I do like how the whole rig comes to an instant stop when you let off the throttle. Hopefully I can expect the same from my PTI. Which reminds me...

I got the Quark Pro Car 33A in the mail a couple days ago. Hopefully I can test it out this weekend I'll try to do a little write-up on it as I go along. This is one nice ESC for the price, that's for sure.

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

Im gonna get some quark products in and do testing. They look like a very promising company with fine products. US made too.

 

[K_B]

I think they're stuff is made in Korea. I figured it was foreign considering the manufacturer of the Quark line is called something kinda weird; Sky and Technology Their website is pretty dope though.

http://www.sky-technology.net/

It's no holmeshobbies.com, but pretty good none-the-less

They've only been around since 2003...

 

[WRXronald]

Ron, what kind of outrunner is it? Sounds like I'm gonna be using my GD-600 (once I get the shaft turned down) :?

I just got my new Mamba-25 into my Park 370 powerd VMG. The thing has unbelievable torque. Too much wheelspeed, but once I get the low-end throttle response / cogging dialed in/out, I think that extra speed will come in handy.

It definitely takes some getting used to. I do like how the whole rig comes to an instant stop when you let off the throttle. Hopefully I can expect the same from my PTI. Which reminds me...

I got the Quark Pro Car 33A in the mail a couple days ago. Hopefully I can test it out this weekend I'll try to do a little write-up on it as I go along. This is one nice ESC for the price, that's for sure.

well i'm not sure which outrunner it is. JRB can better answer that i assume. possibly a 'hand wound' type or something? either way its got great power, no cogging whatsoever while in use. a very light cog if you turn it by hand. and i do mean VERY light. nothing like the cogging of say a WARP4 or something like that.

i'm not sure about your instant stopping though? i'm not sure that's correct. are you sure its not applying 'full' brake at neutral throttle. quick way to find out is to push it by hand once its at neutral. if there's serious resistance, you've either got major cogging effect, or full/part brake being applied due to incorrect throttle programming.

either way-- that could be a nice option. for instance you want to stop and gather your next approach or move on a steep incline. coming back to neutral throttle would normally have you starting to roll backwards. but instead you get an instant stop and no back-roll--- that would be SWEET!!!

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

I think he is referring to a drag brake. zero throttle makes the motor spin zero rpm and no coasting. I have mine programmed that way and I like it.

Your motor is a Holmes Hobbies Revolver 2810. No sticker on it yet, and otherwise they are unbranded.

 

[WRXronald]

I think he is referring to a drag brake. zero throttle makes the motor spin zero rpm and no coasting. I have mine programmed that way and I like it.

Your motor is a Holmes Hobbies Revolver 2810. No sticker on it yet, and otherwise they are unbranded.

yeah that's it.. Drag brake. wish my Kontronic JAZZ had that programming... would be SWEET!

my JAZZ brake is a fully proportional brake across reverse throttle-- you must be carrying forward movement---- if you then move into reverse passing over neutral quickly... you'll get a fully proportional brake across reverse until you pass back to neutral for a second or two.

it works pretty well. much better now that my motor has enough power to bring the rig to a hault even at steep incline (the AXI lacked the power to dead-stop on even slight inclines).

anyways-- love the Revolver 2810---- does the trick!!!

 

[K_B]

I'll have to check the programming, but I thought I set the drag to zero so I was wondering why the thing would come to a stop so suddenly. It might just be because the thing doesn't way anything. Looks like I've got more troubleshooting ahead. I'll see what it does when I move it by hand. That's good to know.

 

[microgoat]

The drag brake is one of the things I really like about the outrunner/Mamba combo. Release the throttle and BAM, you're stopped.

 

[WRXronald]

...

The drag brake is one of the things I really like about the outrunner/Mamba combo. Release the throttle and BAM, you're stopped.

it certainly has its advantages.... i have a mamba sitting around doing nothing. maybe i'll try it in place of the JAZZ.

i did like JAZZ proportional brake for slow-creeping down an incline... you can control your descent at whatever speed you like.

could you do the same with a MAMBA? does the brake have an proportionality to it?

being able to stop on a dime in any certain spot is kinda nice though.

see i can stop like that too... but my problem is getting going again--- because the brake is proportional, if i stop on a steep incline by passing into full reverse quickly... i can stop on dime. but getting started again is tricky. because i have to pass over the proportion of brake (reverse) and as i get closer to neutral (trying to find my way to forward or uphill movement again) i start to roll backwards (as i move to less and less of the brake proportion strength)... once i'm again rolling backwards then forward stick past neutral becomes nothing more than another proportional brake.

maybe i'll try the mamba-- but i just HATE the BEC. :twisted:

 

[microgoat]

So don't use the BEC. I'm not.

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

The brake on the mamba is proportional, and it will act just like the jazz is you are rolling backwards. Forward throttle becomes a proportional brake until you get it stopped.

When you have the drag brake enabled, the throttle will set your downhill decent rate. Give it just a touch of throttle and the rpm will stay constant no matter what the incline- basically regulating your speed and not letting it coast.

 

[rockcrawler01]

Ive been running brushless in EVERYTHING I own. Touring cars (2 turn mega, 3 runs on one pack to everyone elses 1 run a pack. Speed is only 20% faster than the fastest brushed motor on the track) Mini LST with mamba and crawler pinion and main gear (Sorry, I beet yah to this one, just found this sight though), Planes, helis ect. If its electric and I own it its brushless period!
Play with your brake curve and set it up opposise of what you would think
Slow brake to slow reverse increasing reverse speed as you reach the end of the curve. Try it you will like it. Get a watt meter on it as well.

 

[dezfan]

JUst received my Mamba 25 and my Revolver outrunner in the mail today!:mrgreen: It's going in my 2.2 TLT!:twisted: Can't wait for the next comp!

 

[microgoat]

I just downloaded CastleLink v2.15 and there's a bunch of new cool stuff on it. Update your Mamba to the 1.05 software and you get seperate drag brake control (I used 80%, and you can hear the Axi whining trying to keep the crawler stationary on a steep uphill at zero throttle), five power settings instead of three, "punch control" which we're not really going to use (it's another word for current limiting) although it would come in handy if you use cheap cells.

Those guys at Castle are really on the ball. This link is the tits :mrgreen:

 

[dezfan]

Johnrob programmed it for me, I'm sure he hooked it up!:mrgreen: Thanks for the 411. Can't wait to join the revolution!:twisted:

 

[Cloak]

I LOVED my hyperion and my mamba in my Mini-LST. I pulled my mamba and put his outrunner in my tlt crawler and omg, I love this even more.

I'm completly sold on using this combo for my crawlers. I'm already thinking of selling off my other escs to replace everything with brushless.

 

[microgoat]

Johnrob programmed it for me, I'm sure he hooked it up!:mrgreen: Thanks for the 411. Can't wait to join the revolution!:twisted:

dez, you know you have to "introduce" the Mamba to your transmitter in order to get the best performance from it, right? And when you do that, all the settings default to their factory presets. So try it out as is and hope it does the trick for you.

But frankly, being able to program your ESC from your computer is well worth the $25. Just being able to plug it in and see what the settings are is worth the price of admission. It makes ESC programming painless, and this is coming from a guy who doesn't know a CPU from a CPA.

Welcome to the revolution.

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

I got the mamba update software the other day too Micro. It is nicer to have more control! I didnt realize the mamba reset itself with a new TX. I switch my mamba controller around a lot and have never had the settings clear- drag brake always stays on.

On the subject of the Mamba updates, they finally got the startup punch dialed out for heli guys. Took em long enough, but they have a lot on their plate.

Also, talked to Joe at Castle for a while about upcoming tech, and using the controllers for our application. I put a bug in his ear for a 3 amp bec on the Mamba 25, releasing the external voltage regulator (I think we might see both a linear and a switching in 6 months or so), and I picked his brain about motor timing. We both agreed that outrunners aren't very sensitive to timing changes because of the high pole count, but he suggested the lowest timing possible since we stall out the motors. I have been keeping my timing at normal, but just like a brushed motor the motors should run cooler and start up a bit smoother with the lowest possible timing.

Today I will put the Quark controller through some rigors. I woke up early cause I couldn't sleep anymore. Good thing Granny has high speed net.