Finding Nemo’s new setup

[Itali83]

So, a good friend of mine made me an offer I couldn’t refuse on a “used” rig of his. Used is a loose term here as I think he used it twice very gently. My kind of deal! Here it is in his post... http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/vaterra-ascender/593770-my-f100-%93bolt-%94-thread.html

I got it as a slider with no electronics.

Notice the other Furd in the background? Yup, I’ve done gone and lost my mind. Not only do I have two Furds mixing in with my GM trucks, I even jumped ship and got a Traxxas! I have to say that I’m in love with the bronco but that’s another topic for another anonymous help group...

Being that I’m cheap, have no time and another ascender project completely stalled, let’s start another project shall we!?

So, the reason I love my ascenders and will keep building them is that they’re all I’ve built, literally. I know what they need for parts and have gathered quite the spare parts bin full of ascender parts to pick from. Here’s the set up plan at this moment ...

GCM forward motor mount, don’t really like it compared to my mount I made for my other ascender, can be seen in my thread here... http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/vaterra-ascender/570577-my-little-jimmy-lol.html
But this is where the no time part comes into play. I’m already backlogged one custom motor mount for my other truck; this one... http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/vaterra-ascender/594687-topless-jimmy.html

so I’ll just use what I already have. All the cool scale nerds are using it, I might as well join the club.

Going to overdrive the front axle through the GCM transfer case with an easy gear change.

Going to keep this one on all 4 coil overs but use every last trick on the shocks to try and overcome torque twist. Going all in and ditching my tried and true sway bar. Very skeptical about this, but again, everyone else is trying it, might as well too! Stretching rear links to WB 4 because my man Natedog did. Going to cut up the rear cage and drop the body because I’m going to run 4.19” tires and hate body lift look. Plus, ya know, COG man! lol

Wheels and tires I’m at a crossroads. I’m a slot wheel man through and through. I love my gcm slots on my original blazer but here’s where the cheap comes in. I’m not paying that for a set of wheels again. So, I went on trusty eBay and found a set of J.A. Pan made wheels that looked decent. Bought them and received them happy with their looks. Mounted my braves Ironsides up and put them on for mock-up, oh yeah [emoji53] I’ve been down this road before with my last set of fanquish wheels; the offset is crazy and the wheels stick out over half a tire! [emoji107] I can’t stand tires way out, a little, ok but not half and certainly not more than half. After much pondering, I can only gain about 1-2mm’s with some lathe work and that just won’t do. So, it’s either narrow the axles or get different wheels. Any of you guys want to buy a sweet set of aluminum beadlock slot wheels for a good price!? lol

Here’s a few pics of it stripped down and where it is now. I pretty much only have to buy an esc and it’ll be a runner after I’m done hacking and putting it back together so hopefully this one will get finished in a decent amount of time. Not like it matters because I have no time to use it with winter coming and life but I just can’t help myself from building more of these money pits lol.

Brand new stainless links from another used kit I bought. [emoji106]

Ben


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[skybolt]

Subscribed!

 

[Itali83]

Got the rear 3 link mocked up. I’m not a geometry major or master suspension tech, but everything looks good to me, has smooth travel with no binding, and is inline. All using stock parts. The links I’ll end up making to get rid of multiple spacers but this should work....hopefully

I was able to take a set of front shock mounts, turn them around and mount them to the frame. Used the existing front hole to locate the mount, then drilled and tapped the frame for the rear mounts. They do lean back, but since the body mounts won’t be used I don’t see any problem with them. That also makes the rear shocks almost completely vertical with the Wb 4 rear links do that was an added bonus.

I used the battery tray mount for a upper link mount. The links are parallel with my eyeball angle gauge.

I did flip the rear axle because I’m going to overdrive the front axle through the transfer case and that means opposite turning outputs from the transfer case. This should help with torque twist as it did for Ernie I’m hoping.

Going to mount my transfer case next to get driveline in and set pinion angle and make everything hives together then make some permanent links.

If any of you see a glaring issue with this set up let me know but I’m very interested to test this against my original blazer for sure.

Thanks for looking!
Ben

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[Shinchu]

man I'm sad to see it leave the last owner, but glad its in GREAT hands in its new home!
sliders/skids look stunningly similar to mine (but yours have those really cool link risers *oh you cut them off lol). cant wait to see your fwd motor conversion, and the rear panhard turned out super clean!
oh - one thing though... you might want to hang on to those wheels. lower offset stuff has a tendency to bind on that rear panhard axle mount. yours might be okay but my son is limited to only a few types of wheels working on his rent-to-own ascender.

oh and welcome to the GM fan ford owners club lol

cant wait to see where this goes now that Nemo is found... time to find Dory?!

 

[skybolt]

Lookin good!

 

[Itali83]

Been working on rear axle link set up, getting the panhard bar set up so the axle is centered at mid shock travel which is about where the ride height will be when fully dressed.

I’ve been having a really hard time with wheels and tires for this rig. Seen many pictures of these on here with many different tire set ups and they all looked good. Everything I had just didn’t look right. Tires too big or right size tire but 1.9’s looked too big etc etc. I specifically bought a set of the new ssd steel slot wheels for this truck, got the slw .225 hubs so o could get locked up rc lug nuts for the whole scale look. Mounted my braven ironsides I’ve used once on another build. Tires were right size but man, do this wheels look awful to me. TOO BIG!

AND ... every wheel/tire combo I chose, they all stuck out terrible.

Then I finally said screw it, time for 1.55’s. Same size tires but smaller wheel.

Much better. Plus, they just seemed to tuck a wee bit better...

Still not enough but a step in the right direction. So after thinking about it all day, out came the hack saw and 4mm’s came off each axle tube and front panhard bar....

There we go! I like it. Going to leave the rear stock for now, it doesn’t show and since the rear cage is so high above the tires, it’s not enough of an issue to me. Yet anyway!

I do now have some steering interference when turning to the right, the arm on the spindle hits the panhard mount pretty close to full shock compression. I’m going to change to the vaterra aluminum spindles which I have on my blazer and they’re a much lower profile so I’ll probably still have to grind it for clearance but not nearly as much as the plastic pieces on there now.

I actually put the longitudinal servo Mount because it seems the geometry with it is a bit better than the sideways mount. Plus with the forward motor mount, I don’t have to worry about the battery mount getting in the way. But now I do have to worry about where to put the battery...[emoji848][emoji848]

Ben


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[Natedog]

1.9s wheels just look too big as you said, looks great wtih the 1.55s (and slot mags nail the look and era!) and slightly narrowed axle! Have you tried lowering the panhard mount at the frame?

 

[Itali83]

I’d have to raise it Nate because if I lower it it’d hit sooner in the suspension travel. And raising it would be bad because it’d make the pan hard at more of an angle instead of as close to level as possible. I’m thinking with the vaterra aluminum knuckles that have a smaller arm for the tie rod I’ll gain some and with a little massaging get back to full lock. Just placed my order for all the vaterra goodies on sale! C-hubs, knuckles, 4 brass rotors and rear lockouts.

Being lazy with my machining skills on this one and going more for bolt on items. I don’t have any brass axle tubes made up so going for the brass rotors and aluminum parts to help put weight down low. The aluminum wheels just can’t be beat in my book too

Thanks!

Ben

 

[Natedog]

Raising the panhard mount at axle would help roll center and sidehill, raising at the frame would not be good. You should be able to get clearance with a bit of thinking and massaging of parts. Nice score, love the new lower pricing, makes the Vaterra upgrade parts more attractive.

Edit: maybe make your own panhard mount if needed.
LockedUpRC has 0.185" wheel hubs too.
http://www.lockeduprc.com/SLW-Hex-Hubs--185-Dual_p_246.html

 

[Itali83]

Ok Nate, I thought you meant on the frame mount. Yes I agree with you on that part.

Thanks for the link to locked up rc on the .185 hubs. I did search for a thinner hub but was on vanquish’s site and they don’t have anything.

I’m going to try this set up with all the parts and links I have to see how it acts and see if I want to pursue fine tuning or go back to tried and true sway bar.

Thanks again!

Ben

 

[Itali83]

Got Nemo basically done. Got out on my small rock garden area for a little shakedown. I’m very happy with the look of it. I do have some scale bits for the bed but need to mount them. The torque twist is about 90% gone. Enough for me not to care and since I don’t have time to machine new panhard mounts to make them farther from frame and the bar note level, I’m just gonna send it. Very cool to see the suspension cycling like it should and the body level like it should. Thank you guys so much for all the R and D that I ripped off from you lol.

Got the bumper tucked in and added new lower bars to protect the body and not block the marker lights.

Wired up my warn winch and mounted it. I had an axial ae5 esc from a used truck I bought. Great winch controller because it was free. It’s a bit big and heavy, but again, free. Wired it up and tell ya what, that little warn winch gets it done on straight 3s power

Made some quick black gorilla tape inner fenders too.

Going to be getting this out on the rocks in a few weeks. Going to play follow the leader with my tried and true blazer with the sway bar and see how they stack up with each other.

Ben



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[M1tch]

Some nice work there. I'm looking at altering the panhard mount on chassis now I have some GPM shock towers which have a bolt on mount so i might be able to lower it.

 

[Itali83]

Thank you. I was very skeptical on this set up but it seems to work so far. I also did the shock collar mod on the rear shocks. Out board mounted the bottom rear shocks. But the biggest variable is the fact that I’m overdriving the front axle through the transfer case, which means that the rear axle is flipped upside down and the driveshafts are turning opposite directions in theory negating the torque twist. So, that being said, I’m not sure which is helping torque twist the most. Suspension set up or driveline setup.

Ben

 

[2mtech]

Looking good!! For a Furd, ya know..."thumbsup"

 

[Itali83]

Dubbed around on the old furd tonight. Had a few scale bits I wanted to mount to the bed. I really like the look of these gear head recovery ramps. I wanted them to stay put but be easily removable. I took two old pieces of the cage I removed to make room for the custom rear shock mounts, made stands out of them and drilled for a body clip.

Mounted my cooler with soda in it

And my mid evil homemade pull pall on the left rear.

I’m going to be ordering some shackles, tow straps and some bungees to add to the look and keep things in place. Can’t wait to test this thing out on the big rocks in a week or so!

Ben


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[skybolt]

Wait a minute...did I see an Axial battery tray somewhere??

 

[Itali83]

Wait a minute...did I see an Axial battery tray somewhere??

Not sure I know what you’re talking about.... don’t worry, I has been de-identified properly now lol.

 

[Itali83]

So, got Nemo out on the rocks for a real test run. Gotta say, less than satisfied with the set up. It was unpredictable on very steep and off camber climbs. Would lift drivers side front wheel from torque twist (my rear axle is in upside down because of transfer case). Not really sure where to go from here. It feels like the rear springs are soft which they may be, this truck is very nose heavy and I’ve got the preload in the rear backed all the way off so the truck isn’t doing a complete nose dive while on level ground. If my problems are really rooted in the panhard bar not being mounted far enough outside of frame rails then I’ll probably scrap the set up and go with my tried and tested sway bar. Not really sure what to do if the shocks are too soft. I’ve already internally limited the shocks 10mm, and done the shock collar mod and outboarded them. They’re almost perfectly vertical too so they’re not at too much of an angle. I got very frustrated with it when my stock trx4 except for portal weights was pulling lines with less effort with open diffs than Nemo was ...��. Just seeing if I’m missing something simple. Thanks guys.

Ben

 

[M1tch]

Shame it didn't drive that well. The only thing that has reduced to torque twist on my K10 is the Gmade Dual Rate shocks. They really have made a difference. Maybe just try a pair either front or rear. They work in a similar way to the modded stock shocks. Only thing against them is they are larger diameter, but still clear the front wheel on full lock.

Apart from that, just keep trying stuff. I wonder if a different brands spring would fit the Vaterra shocks.

 

[mgputer]

So, got Nemo out on the rocks for a real test run. Gotta say, less than satisfied with the set up. It was unpredictable on very steep and off camber climbs. Would lift drivers side front wheel from torque twist (my rear axle is in upside down because of transfer case). Not really sure where to go from here. It feels like the rear springs are soft which they may be, this truck is very nose heavy and I’ve got the preload in the rear backed all the way off so the truck isn’t doing a complete nose dive while on level ground. If my problems are really rooted in the panhard bar not being mounted far enough outside of frame rails then I’ll probably scrap the set up and go with my tried and tested sway bar. Not really sure what to do if the shocks are too soft. I’ve already internally limited the shocks 10mm, and done the shock collar mod and outboarded them. They’re almost perfectly vertical too so they’re not at too much of an angle. I got very frustrated with it when my stock trx4 except for portal weights was pulling lines with less effort with open diffs than Nemo was ...[emoji35]. Just seeing if I’m missing something simple. Thanks guys.

Ben

To help keep the front down you need to stiffen the pre-load on the rear shocks.

Also if it was acting unpredictable it's a good sign the spring pre-load is to soft all the way round .

There are several things you can do like out boarding the rear shocks and the shock MOD. All easy and pretty much cost free.

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