ECSs, Servos, Motors, Batteries

[IronArcher]

Sorry, the search function just gave too much results that weren't what I needed.

BASICALLY, I'm looking at upgrades, and parts for a new Element Gate keeper, but the model doesn't really matter (or does it?).

From what I gather, most kits skimp out on one or more of the following
ESC
Steering Servo
Motor

And at the same time, most require you to add your own batteries.

It also seems that most beginner kits will take 2s or 3s batteries. What are the benefits of each? Is there a down side other than price to the 3s?
How do you pick how much servo you might need? Lets just say, I'd like to try 2.2 wheels and 5.5 tires, is 25k enough?
How does battery selection affect this?
Same for motors, How do you pick how many slots and turns for a motor (mostly brushless for the time being)?
Does a 2200kv motor put out more power with a 3s than a 2500kv with a 2s?

If I missed a thread that ties this all together, please link it here ;-)

At the moment, I'm thinking I want a HobbyWing 1080, if for no other reason than it's highly rated, and gives many more options to tweak than stock, but not sure what motor, or servo, or even batteries I want, and how they affect the other choices. Are some receivers NOT compatible with a 3s battery pack?

Yes, I am going too fast and getting in too deep, that's just me.

Thanks in advance!

 

[rob5059]

Slow down. Run the GK and figure out what you want to do with it, what you like or dislike. Upgrade from there.

You got a GK, so you need a short battery pack. I personally run 3S 1300mah batteries in all of my trucks. On the GK a 1300mah battery will fit between the servo and shock tower, and I move the electronic to the battery plate. This will add more weight over the front axle. The 3S will give you the extra punch, more wheel speed. With a discharged 3S you have around 9.6v. With a 2S your discharge voltage is around 6.4v. This affects your wheel speed, punch, and and servo strength and speed.

The stock esc and motor are OK. Are they great, no. Do they work, yes. I would personally run it until you figure out how you are going to use the truck. Comp rig, trail rig, or go fast brasher. They all have different needs.

The stock servo is not that impressive. Personally I would go on Amazon a purchase the blue 35K servo. This will get you started.

Do not cheap out on the battery charger. Make sure it is adjustable, can support different battery types, and has the storage mode function. Get some LiPo battery bags and an ammo can to store them in. Pick up a fire extinguisher.

Now if you want 2.2 wheels, make sure you get wheels that have different hub options. You will most likely need a 475 hub so the tire does not rub on the body.

 

[King Dork]

Rob5059 gave you some solid advice there. I have a “EctoKeeper (Gatekeeper kit build/body swapped for Ecto)” which I’ve tried several setup combinations on. Current setup is: Hobbywing Fusion 2300 Pro, Powerhobby 8014MG 14v direct power servo on front axle mount, 11% front OD, Chinesium Wang Chung beadlocks, Proline Krawlers in Predator compound w/CI dual stage foams, 1300-1500 3s lipo. I did a few small mods: pen spring mod on stock shocks, and cut 10mm off of front of frame rails to tuck bumper back. She’s a dead silent crawling beast.
Before anyone can give you really good advice for your rig I’d absolutely suggest letting us know how you plan on using it. If you’re main objectives are to mainly trail it and crawl over whatever you find while out on the trails, I wouldn’t change anything until you drive it for a while and tell us what you like or dislike. Basically all stock rtr electronics leave a lot to be desired, but will get the job done for now unless you really get into some technical crawling. I’d personally stay with 1.9 wheels/tires. When these first came out several guys ran them at the local track with big 2.2 wheels/tires and not only did they look weird, but they performed poorly. Also, stick with 3s lipo. More voltage allows you to run a smaller pinion for better low speed control and still have plenty of top speed. Decent 1300-1500mah 3s lipos are fairly inexpensive and will give you immediate performance gains. Servo also depends on your intended use. Technical crawling is far more demanding on a servo than trailing. You also need to factor in that a stronger servo may require either direct power or an external bec.
I know there are so many things to learn about but try to keep things simple at first and just drive the rig and become familiar with it. Also, try to avoid throwing a crap load of brass everywhere imaginable because most new drivers assume that it’ll help. I rarely add brass anywhere except the front knuckles and all of my rigs (15) perform very well.

 

[IronArcher]

Thanks to both replies so far.

For me, the main use will be informal rock crawling. Most likely, I’ll do a comp here and there. But mainly just local not terribly serious type stuff.
I’m already starting to build a course for my back yard, so friends can come over and play.
I see a smaller amount of time spent trail crawling, but very little “bashing”.
Please be patient with my definitions of those terms, again, full on newb.
So far, other than running it to see what it needs (and yes, I know I am going too fast. I enjoy the gadget side of many hobbies… these things are gadget overload LOL!) I have been following much of your advice.
In addition to the RTR, I have purchased:
Battery charger with wide range of capabilities. Highly rated, but not too quality
(2) 1500mah batteries 100c rated (they were cost effective
A 35kg brushless servo (after reading a bunch, many preferred the brushless servo… price wasn’t bad, and it’s blue LOL!
And lastly, I couldn’t help myself. Hearing so much hate for the stock electrics, I got a Hobbywing 1080. MAINLY for the low speed controllability it’s praised for, and also as the stock ESC reportedly is not very adjustable.

Thanks for the info on the 2.2s I figure, if I find a cheap set at a swap meet, maybe I’ll try some. Not going to buy new until I see a benefit.

Also, thanks for the advise on brass. I was thinking of just some as you mentioned for the front axle. Many seem to suggest throwing everything you can at brass. I haven’t ordered anything brass yet.

I think I’ll be good for now. I have enough gadget upgrades to calm my inner 8 year old!
I am most likely going to do something like the Ecto body in time. I know I said competitions aren’t a priority, but would like to keep it at least class 2 legal.

My next project is a measuring board. I plan on making measurements of every change I make. Not because I need to, but to help me (and maybe others) see how much effect each change makes. I also have a few ideas up my sleeve, and will like to test them first.

Thanks again for the advice. Glad to see I wasn’t TOO far off

 

[King Dork]

And lastly, I couldn’t help myself. Hearing so much hate for the stock electrics, I got a Hobbywing 1080. MAINLY for the low speed controllability it’s praised for, and also as the stock ESC reportedly is not very adjustable.

Thanks for the info on the 2.2s I figure, if I find a cheap set at a swap meet, maybe I’ll try some. Not going to buy new until I see a benefit.

Also, thanks for the advise on brass. I was thinking of just some as you mentioned for the front axle. Many seem to suggest throwing everything you can at brass. I haven’t ordered anything brass yet.

I am most likely going to do something like the Ecto body in time. I know I said competitions aren’t a priority, but would like to keep it at least class 2 legal.

1080 is definitely a great low cost big upgrade esc over the stock. Just pay attention to any brown outs due to a high powered servo. The internal bec in the 1080 is fair, but definitely has its limits.

Believe me. 120mm tires and 1.9 wheels will get you over anything. Plus, the bigger the tire the less steering throw you’ll able to achieve before rubbing on the body or the links.

These are the brass steering knuckles I run on mine and these made an amazing difference: PARTS FOR ENDUROHeavy Brass Knuckles for Enduro
This rig absolutely doesn’t need much weight to perform. One similarity that crawling has to racing is that the lightest weight possible while maintaining traction will give you the best performance, along with how you distribute the weight. 60/40 front to rear, and 50/50 side to side weight distribution is a good sweet spot for most rigs and anything really close to these numbers will make you happy. Before I had a corner weight scale my Gmade GS02 Komodo Double Cab had the best feel of all my rigs on the rocks. After getting a set of corner weight scales that truck actually had a 60/40, 50/50 weight distribution, also with weight added at only the front axles.

The Ecto body is probably the most common upgrade. I don’t remember the actual measurements on the scale, but the Ecto body after I painted it was 1/3 of the cage’s weight. I did not install the plastic roll bar that came with the body. I lowered my shocks slightly with pen springs and it handled surprisingly well with the stock cage but after switching to the Ecto body the improvement was obvious.

You’ll really enjoy the rig. Definitely one of the best performing chassis out of the box.

 

[IronArcher]

Thanks for the link and info!
I’m sure the Ecto has more potential, and an easier time getting to 60/40, but I have seen a couple videos where the stock Ecto just seemed too light… maybe just too light for the tires/foams it comes with, where the Gatekeeper seemed to work better stock vs. stock. Of course that all changes with tires/foam/weight.

After diving a bit more into the new SORRCA rules, man! What a way to give someone buyers remorse anxiety [emoji23][emoji1787][emoji23]
If it stays SORRCA complain or not, I no longer really care.
I’m just going to have fun with it. Hopefully local clubs are a bit less “eccentric” with the rules.
I just want to be in a class of similar performance. I’m not going to worry about if I get an extra -1 for having a flatbed that is .125” or more [emoji849]

I’m still excited to get the car and start working with it. Not at ALL excited to find that last -1 for SORRCA [emoji23][emoji1787][emoji23]

 

[lonleycreeper]

Thanks for the link and info!
I’m sure the Ecto has more potential, and an easier time getting to 60/40, but I have seen a couple videos where the stock Ecto just seemed too light… maybe just too light for the tires/foams it comes with, where the Gatekeeper seemed to work better stock vs. stock. Of course that all changes with tires/foam/weight.

After diving a bit more into the new SORRCA rules, man! What a way to give someone buyers remorse anxiety [emoji23][emoji1787][emoji23]
If it stays SORRCA complain or not, I no longer really care.
I’m just going to have fun with it. Hopefully local clubs are a bit less “eccentric” with the rules.
I just want to be in a class of similar performance. I’m not going to worry about if I get an extra -1 for having a flatbed that is .125” or more [emoji849]

I’m still excited to get the car and start working with it. Not at ALL excited to find that last -1 for SORRCA [emoji23][emoji1787][emoji23]

The local comps in my area are more run what you brung, and comps are very relaxed. I am sure you will be fine. Personally, I like light rigs, usually in the 5lb range with a battery. Soft foams make them perform well and I surprise a lot of comp rigs with my scale trucks. eg my Trail king...

 

[IronArcher]

Nice! That’s what I’m hoping for.

Funny thing, now that my Gatekeeper is in the way, a local is selling an Ecto [emoji35]
I need to find out the body he has on it, it looks great.


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